3rd IHE Europe Pharmacy meeting

13 people at the meeting, 7 from France.


Only with Spain, Netherlands, France and, new, Belgium.


Review points of the last meeting

The first point was on the international property in IHE.

There is no intellectual property on the contributions.

No logo and no copyright for all documents of IHE !
Just contributors with the name of theirs association/company.

All association/company need to sign an International governance with IHE. EAHP is part of IHE International.

In a near future we will have IT pharmacists from UK (need the Guild approval), Germany, Spain, and why not, Turkey.

2 special points of this group :
1) majority of women and
2) majority of users. 😀

If it’s good for use cases,for the next meetings it will be necessary to have more vendors. And to ask COCIR is easy because we are in the good place. There is more international players/vendors than local.

In the frame of patient safety : the unit dose in the hospital will be developed in EU ! There are big EU project for patient safety to reduce medication errors. A lot of problems of label …

Back on the IT scope : on what are we working ?
The best of the IT world or the « real » world ?

Community pharmacy

A presentation of Spain & Netherlands :

There is 2 main different approaches, the centralised one and the decentralised one.
In Spain, the Andalousia model is centralised.
There is central DB with prescriptions, dispensations, citizen registry, invoicing, patient health record (allergies, contraindications,health episodes) The messages are not standards based but now the work is with HL7 groups.

In the Netherlands (NL) : decentralised (central reference index, not the data) The pointers are to the patients’ health data.

In the 2 cases, the roles and messages are the same. (but different contents OK) It seems the logical framework is the same. It’s store an index or store all documents.

  • It’s a challenge in NL to maintain the data at all the points of production. It cost money for pharmacists.
    The choice was done because 5 years ago the HL7 CDA was not ready to store documents with HL7v3 messages. So every producer is responsible of his data.

What is about store data for public health purposes …

==> Review of the Community Pharmacy document.
There is differences of laws between countries.

  • Prescription producer (order placer)
  • Prescription repository
  • Prescription information consumer
  • Dispensation information consumer
  • Dispensation information repository
    ==> ICD active ingredient / rights to change the medication ; link to the prescription repository and the dispensation repository
  • Dispensing information registry :
    links to all repositories in this process (NL case)
  • Patient identity provider (PIP)
  • Dispensation information producer : Pharmacy’s point of sale software
  • Validation agent : general pharmaceutical validation module
  • Infrastructure provider
  • Prescription broker
  • Invoicing broker
  • College of pharmacists system

Health system invoicing system ==> place in this in the introduction not as an actor.

[Here was the time for lunch]

We start with the review the diagram of the workflow.

Notice that no indication is transmitted. Indications and diagnosis stay in GP software.

Need internal validation before all others advices.
After, PGEU advice will be recommended …

The need is to finish in mid next year a technical framework : a trial for implementation and next to demonstrate in 2010.



Hospital pharmacy

The hospital process is presented by France.

In the generic process : picking and dose preparation is the « black box » : depend of the cases of organization.

« IT is about simplification » note Geert. 🙂
Need to describe the different cases behind « Picking and dose preparation » : use Dispense.

Make difference between role and action.
Example : Role : prescriber, action: prescribe.

Need to focus on the first use case. The scope in 3 lines need to be added. For Prescription, Order placer (IHE terminology) must be added to the document.


One big document for ePharmacy : it’s the same technical framework.

IT telephonic conference @ the beginning of July : the proposal is 4th July from 11:00 to noon.
The next meeting will be a 2 days session: 11 & 12 September.

The need is to finalize the scope in one document with community AND hospital.
And « seal » that to the IT vendors, those of the community first. The needs of connection seems to be greater in Community pharmacy.

This ePharmacy meetings are only a task force inside IHE Europe at the moment. But at this step, we will know soon if the IHE domain Pharmacy will be open.

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4 commentaires pour 3rd IHE Europe Pharmacy meeting

  1. Tom dit :

    >Hello Simon,You write « It’s a challenge in NL to maintain the data at all the points of production. It cost money for pharmacists.The choice was done because 5 years ago the HL7 CDA was not ready to store documents with HL7v3 messages. So every producer is responsible of his data. »Can you explain what you mean with that? I’m from the Netherlands AND I was at the meeting, yet I don’t recognize what your statement saysMerci,Tom


  2. >Thanks for the comment :)Well… – You were @ the 4th meeting not the 3rd one (see photo 🙂 ). – It’s part of a discussion between Mr Gener and Mr Sprenger about data management : the community pharmacists are the data producers and they store all their data. Only the adress of the data is shared and centralized through the Aorta. That what I understood and have heard.


  3. Tom dit :

    >Hello Simon,You are right, I thought your report was about the last meeting. As for the statement you make: of course the data is shared, it’s just not stored centrally. But still, I don’t see what that has to do with what you wrote before… Why a challenge to maintain decentralized data? Why would it cost the pharmacists money? What does this have to do with CDA?Bonjour, Tom


  4. >Hello Tom,I don’t see what that has to do with what you wrote before… Why a challenge to maintain decentralized data? I think you can’t be sure to retrieve all the data.It’s like a request on the Web : you don’t retrieve the same content one day and another.Why would it cost the pharmacists money ?If they don’t delete any data, they have to store more and more. I think it was a part of the discussion. What does this have to do with CDA?Using CDA is commonly use for a centralized option. Seen like the opposite, maybe I’m wrong.Kind regards,Simon



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